Is it realistic to expect Devs and IT Ops staff to get along ?


I know that DevOps is trying to get us to work together, but is that realistic in large projects ? We are entirely different types of people, and aptitudes. Why should we be expcted to get along ?

I would be interested in where established organisations (not startups) see value between Apps and software staff, and the deployment and IT staff ?

Comments (12)

12 responses to “Is it realistic to expect Devs and IT Ops staff to get along ?”

  1. Vladimir Carli

    I am not a developer but I work for both, a startup and a large organization. In the large organization I see IT ops staff mostly as creating problems instead of solving them. Solutions they offer are usually worse and more expensive than what is available on the market, support is close to 0. I guess they have to take unpopular choices to mantain security but then they force everyone to change their password every 6 months and you suddenly loose faith

  2. simont

    They don't have to be friends but they do have to work together. Get along or the business suffers and then people loose jobs.

  3. yaddamaster

    not only realistic but necessary and required. But it helps if the reporting structure for DevOps and Developers flows upwards to the same person WAY before the CIO. Preferably no higher than a staff VP level.

    • yaddamaster

      In reply to yaddamaster:

      I'll also add: some of the best DevOps people are good developers that have been moved into that role. And if you want to move upwards in your career (architect, manager) it really helps to have some exposure to each area. There's nothing that says you can't move into DevOps for a year or two, learn everything you can, and then move back into development. In fact, it's usually encouraged.

  4. wright_is

    In the last 30 years, whether I've worked as a developer or an admin, we have worked hand in hand with each other.

    I worked as a developer in the 80s and 90s and we always worked closely with the admins. In fact at one site, we had an aD&D evening every week and it was 50/50 admins and developers. We were all their because of our love of technology and the new. We always worked well together.

    In the early 2000s,i was an admin, then a dev again at the end of the decade and for the last 3 years I've been an admin again.

    The one can't do their job properly without the full support of the other.

  5. earlster

    With software moving increasingly to the cloud, or at least web based implementations, I see it as increasingly important that the two work together. With once a year released drops ship software, developers really only have QA as a 'hurdle' to clear.

    In an agile cloud world with frequent releases and a crazy amount of dependencies on 3rd party frameworks, networks and storage. With issues around security and scaling, DevOps is a super important member of the whole pictures and as a manager it's super important to me to make sure that they not just barely work together, but have a good relationship.

    As a former developer I understand that process sometimes seems to get in the way of getting that latest cool piece of code out, but with proper collaboration and planning this can be solved. But it's important that this is supported by management and is made part of the organizational culture.

  6. wunderbar

    Not only is it realistic, it's required.

    This question a weird premise because at work you have to be professional with everyone you work with. If you're going around saying "I hate working with [this person]" I think you might find you're not working with that person anymore because you no longer have a job. that doesn't matter what my job is or their job is, you're expected to be able to work with anyone/everyone.

    Is everyone in the company I work for my friend? No. Would I go out and have a beer with every single person I work with? No. do some people get on my nerves some days? absolutely. Do I work with everyone in a professional manner so we all move towards the same goal and try to succeed in our jobs? Yes.

  7. daniel7878

    Why is it even an us vs them situation? If I code something "X" and that something needs built and deployed 'now'... and that goes against some dev ops deployment schedule... Why do we assume it's a battle between the developer and the dev ops? I need it now.. dev ops says no deployment today... I'm not going to argue with them.. just escalate and let management decide. I refuse at my company to let each department's procedures become conflicting ideas. When in doubt, escalate to management.

  8. Patrick3D

    In my experience the ability to sit down with lead developers for a few minutes has been key to solving some crazy edge case issues. If the only communication that exists is a ticketing system then expect nothing but a blame game. The larger the organization gets though, the more internal politics will start to get in the way. Having a competent director or better yet, VP, becomes crucial. At its worst, I've seen an installation package fix for an internally deployed piece of software get held back for over 3 years simply because the deployment manager was demanding a budget increase and refusing to push changes to existing packages until she got it.

  9. hrlngrv

    To the extent one group wants nothing unexpected and the other needs to debug software (thus fix the unexpected), there's an unavoidable tension between their respective roles. If you mean different personality types tend to gravitate to one or the other, learn to get along. You think accountants and marketing people are symbiotic?

  10. ghostrider

    DevOps roles are often just thrown at IT departments as well - no real thought for the differences. A standard IT jock taking on DevOps, with the different thought processes required will often create a conflict of interests. They do need to be treated differently, but sadly, that's often not the case.