Windows 10 irritation

22

I’m really sorry that I “upgraded” to W10. I bought my HP Envy23 already bundled with W8.1. It was totally functional, and even though my PC has touchscreen, I still use the traditional mouse/keyboard combo. I don’t need any whizz-bang features, just a reliable PC.

When I got the offer to “upgrade” to W10, I thought it would be a good move. Sadly, the Start button problem soon reared its ugly head, and is SO annoying. I’ve put a ClassicShell start app on. MS still haven’t addressed the problem.

When The latest “upgrades” were announced I thought that maybe the “start” problem might be fixed. Wrong.

Now, I can’t use my CD/DVD external drives (there isn’t an internal one on the Envy), so I can’t reload the scanner and VHS conversion software I had on W8.1.

So right now, I’m using my lovely PC as an email machine and a little bit of printing – I managed to d/l the samsung laser s/w to be able to use it.

So, in conclusion. Microsoft continues to disappoint and frustrate me. I was quite happy using XP, but thought that maybe the old MS “use the customers as r&d” attitude had gone. All the “help” and “troubleshooting” guides have, for me just been a total waste of time.

I wish I could get back to W8.1, so if anyone has any ideas, I’d be grateful.

Comments (22)

22 responses to “Windows 10 irritation”

  1. Siv

    I would have thought you could use the System Recovery option. Most Dell and HP computers have a key combination you can press when the computer starts that allows you to run a system restore back to its original factory setup. If you have completely reformatted the disk and the recovery partition has been lost you can get a CD (or an iso download to make a CD) from HP Support that you can then boot your PC from and get it to do the restore back to factory settings, which would put it back to how it was when you purchased it. It may even be that you have a recovery CD as part of the original packaging that came with the machine?

  2. Patrick3D

    How is it that your external CD/DVD drives don't work? USB drives are plug and play, no 3rd party driver required. I am also amazed that you considered the Win8.1 Start menu better than the Win10 Start menu when the overwhelming consensus is the opposite. Not to mention that you can configure the Win10 Start menu to behave identically to the Win8.1 menu with a single setting: Personalization > Start > Use Start Full Screen. So far you have only really indicated a single issue being a problem loading some VHS conversion software, as if that's the end of the world.

    Anyways, you can always downgrade, just grab a Win8.1 installer from Microsoft's website, put it on a USB memory stick and reinstall 8.1. For an OEM machine your license is already built-in, no key needed.

  3. Tony Barrett

    Just thought I'd chime in here if anyone is still reading.


    For the benefit of Lordbaal1, during the first 12 months, the GWX initiative *did* upgrade many computers to Win10 without the users specific consent, and many upgrades didn't work properly and rendered the PC useless. You couldn't remove the GWX app unless you really knew what you were doing, or could edit the registry. The messages were confusing or downright deceiving as time went on, up to the point where clicking the red 'X' actually approved the installation. This was widely known, and MS got mauled for it, and only vaguely acknowledged they were too heavy handed with GWX after July 2016 came and went - all damage done by that point.

    MS knew that adding a 'don't upgrade and don't ask again' option - which they should have done - would have cut the number of upgrades in half instantly, and they couldn't allow that. They projected 500m installs in the first 12 months, but still only achieved half that. Failure.

    MS *do* ship many generic drivers with Win10, but rely on OEM's to create the rest. Upgrades are always risky, and the Win10 'upgrade' even more so. It was generally considered a mess, and caused a huge number of problems for many, which MS didn't even have a plan for (the rollback was equally risky!)

  4. lordbaal1

    Microsoft doet not make the drivers for your devices. All the is the hardware manufacture, so blame them, no MS.

    • skane2600

      In reply to lordbaal1:

      MS should not have pushed people to upgrade (or in some cases upgrade without specific authorization) if they had reason to believe that legacy drivers were incompatible with Windows 10. They decided that the advertising value of saying that millions of people upgraded was more important than the risk that the upgrade would compromise people's PCs.

      • lordbaal1

        In reply to skane2600:

        Now one forced anyone to install anything.

        You had to say install for it to install.

        • skane2600

          In reply to lordbaal1:

          If there wasn't a dialog asking the specific question "Do you want to upgrade to Windows 10, Yes, No, or ask me later" that takes no action if there's no response, then yes, it's a forced install. It's arrogant of people to deny other people's experiences. Unless you have examined all the relevant MS code, you have no basis to say nobody had Windows 10 install without permission.


          https://www.forbes.com/sites/gordonkelly/2015/11/10/microsoft-admits-windows-10-automatic-installs/#474a85a3b4c2

          • lordbaal1

            In reply to skane2600:

            That's BS. If you do not say yes, it will not install.

            Maybe it will download the update, but not install itself.

            • skane2600

              In reply to lordbaal1:

              You're just repeating the same unproven claim despite the fact that I provided you with contrary evidence. Do you really believe that many people woke up one morning and decided to falsely accuse MS of installing Windows 10 without permission?

              • lordbaal1

                In reply to skane2600:

                And how many of these stories have been proven to be true.

                • skane2600

                  In reply to lordbaal1:

                  Without access to all the relevant source code or some other evidence it's impossible to prove or disprove. But personal accounts are much better evidence than a simple denial. Putting aside the possibility of deliberate action or attempts to trick people into saying "yes" by MS, the nature of bugs in a complex system is that they are often triggered by a very specific set of circumstances. With the millions of Windows PCs in the wild it's not surprising that some of these corner cases occur. So the fact that one group of people didn't experience a specific problem isn't definitive evidence that other people haven't.


                  As a long time software developer I've seen too many cases where developers have sworn that a reported bug couldn't possibly happen, only to find that it has.

  5. jimchamplin

    None of that is Windows 10's fault. It'll run better and be more secure than 8 on your hardware. The problems are twofold.

    1) You were running a janky OEM install. They're always questionable and should be nuked and reinstalled before you do anything.

    2) It was an upgrade install. Always more problematic, especially when it was done over the aforementioned OEM crap.

    A fresh install gives you a factory-new version of Windows with none of the garbage.

    • skane2600

      In reply to jimchamplin:

      If what you say is true MS should never have pushed everyone to upgrade. How many people do you imagine were running a non-OEM version of Windows 8? Sorry but if there's a problem after upgrading to Windows 10 for any reason, MS owns it.

      • jimchamplin

        In reply to skane2600:

        Nine times of ten it works fine. Now what they should never have allowed was for OEMs to modify the install image *at all.*

        • hrlngrv

          In reply to jimchamplin:

          Shame US courts have found MSFT has no legal basis to prevent OEMs from altering Windows images preinstalled on PCs, so MSFT can do nothing at all about this at least in the US.

          Well, MSFT could do one thing. Sell Windows itself, and OEMs could sell most if not all new PCs with no OS at all. Everyone buying a new PC would have to install an OS themselves. That'd give MSFT complete control of what's installed by people who want to install Windows.

          Shame MSFT has no interest in that approach as it'd make installing alternative OSes, i.e., NOT Windows, simpler and likely more common.

          Nope, MSFT would prefer OEMs do whatever they want to Windows images as long as those OEMs pay MSFT for Windows licenses on damn near all new PCs. If that's not in PC users' best interests, well, screw PC users. MSFT has its revenues to worry about.

          • lwetzel

            In reply to hrlngrv:

            "MSFT would prefer OEMs do whatever they want to Windows images as long as those OEMs pay MSFT for Windows licenses on damn near all new PCs."

            That is MSFT's business model and has been from day one. Apple chose to make hardware and limit it to their OS and that was Apple's business model. Had Apple had their way you would have an Apple and OSX and screw everyone who couldn't afford it and those that would choose to have something different. So your point was?

            • hrlngrv

              In reply to lwetzel:

              You're the one trotting out irrelevancies.

              Yes, Apple has a different model. Yes, if Apple sold 85% of all units in use, things would be different. If the asteroid hadn't hit 65 million years ago, we wouldn't be here. Etc.

              I'll make it simpler. MSFT wants to wholesale Windows license kits to OEMs because that's steadier and likely more revenue from Windows for MSFT. However, given certain points decided in US v MSFT, as a wholesaler, MSFT may exercise no control over anything OEMs do to PCs after installing Windows. MSFT prefers the revenues to making PC users' lives easier.

              Do you understand now?

              • lwetzel

                In reply to hrlngrv:

                Now see you got your panties in a knot. "MSFT prefers the revenues " was my point.

                • hrlngrv

                  In reply to lwetzel:

                  My point is MSFT prefers its current revenue model to making PC users' lives arguably easier with pristine Windows images which could only happen if MSFT retailed Windows to PC owners rather than wholesaled Windows to OEMs.

                  If you will, MSFT prefers revenues to giving PC users the best possible Windows.

                • jimchamplin

                  In reply to hrlngrv:

                  Maybe that’s why PCs are flagging. Say what you will about Google, they care about the user experience. Apple makes record profits by selling a product with a superior experience.

                  iOS 11’s current beta is considered to easily be the buggiest iOS public beta yet, and still, it isn’t as unpredictable as the shipping version of 1703. Maybe it’s the fact that Microsoft has never had a “quiet” release.

                  One where there aren’t features, only going in and fixing long standing issues, refactoring slow code, and generally getting rid of a few of the thousand papercuts that make Windows so damn frustrating.

            • skane2600

              In reply to lwetzel:

              I don't get your point. Nobody is suggesting that MS should adopt Apple's business model of not allowing their OS to run on hardware from other makers.

  6. evox81

    Definitely agreed with most of the people here. This doesn't sound like a general Windows 10 issue. This sounds like a problem with your particular upgrade installation on your particular machine, with that particular crappy OEM install of 8.1. I'd back up everything, wipe the drive clean and reinstall Windows 10 fresh.

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