Thinking About Windows 10 Alternatives

Thinking About Windows 10 Alternatives

With Microsoft looking at new ways of monetizing Windows 10—in many cases, with ever-aggressive advertising in the product itself—I’m getting a lot of questions about alternatives. And while the case for moving off Windows 10 on PCs is not clear, I feel the frustration too.

In fact, I spend a lot more time than you may realize exploring those alternatives. This week alone, I’ve done work on macOS, using my MacBook Air, and I’ve installed the latest versions of Ubuntu and Mint Linux. In other recent weeks, I’ve spent time with a surprisingly high-quality Acer Chromebook as well.

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I do this with no sense of joy. And to be clear I still find Windows 10 to be the obvious winner when I evaluate what it is that I’m looking for personally. And that’s true regardless of my job: Were I to suddenly hit the lottery, I’d keep using Windows 10 myself. I mean, I’d probably buy a really expensive Surface PC. But I would stick with Windows 10.

This isn’t the case on phone, of course, nor is it true on tablets. On these form factors, Windows 10 is either unusable (phone) or pointless because of the lack of ecosystem support (tablet). Phones and tablets, though, are more clear-cut: You should choose iPhone or Android on phone (I prefer iPhone), and iPad if you want a tablet. (I am not aware of a single decent Android tablet, which I still find curious.)

But the PC? Hm.

There are all kinds of ways to evaluate other platforms, and of course we all have our own needs, wants, and time-hardened workflows, any one of which will bias our view of these alternatives. But if you look at this from a high level, there is a simple comparison to make: Do you miss any key functionality from Windows 10 when using a different platform? Conversely, are there features or functionality in that other platform that make it superior, in some way, to what you’re using now?

Broadly speaking, I feel that Windows 10 does well when I make this comparison, and that is something I do fairly regularly. For all the nits—the in-OS advertising, in particular—Windows 10, to me, is still the clear choice.

But. There’s always a but. I have found things in other systems that I really appreciate. The ability to easily sign-in to a Chromebook simply by having your Android phone nearby, for example. (Something like this is coming, eventually, to Windows 10.) And the simple iCloud-based syncing features in macOS which let you view and access the contents of key system folders, including the desktop, across both Macs and i-devices. (Something that would have prevented my recent data loss.) That kind of thing.

So I evaluate. And I compare. And I will keep doing so, and if the worst thing that happens is that I can state with some degree of experience that Windows 10 is still the best choice, then great. If I find that not to be case or, more likely, can point out places where Windows 10 is falling short, then that’s great too. Maybe by prodding Microsoft a bit, we can all help Windows 10 better as a result.

With all that in mind, and in increasing order of craziness, here’s a quick look at the Windows 10 alternatives. Your take on the relative pros and cons of each may differ, of course. But here’s where I’m at.

#1. Windows 8.1

Advantages: It’s like Windows 10 without most of the bullshit, modern desktop UI, runs Windows desktops applications

Disadvantages: Will never see another feature update, “Metro” apps are stuck in time and it doesn’t support UWP apps, would be expensive to purchase

Bottom line: If you stick to the desktop environment—which you should, frankly—Windows 8.1 is an interesting alternative. Assuming, that is, that you already own Windows 8.x (or, more to the point, your PC came with Windows 8.x): Buying a copy of Windows 8.1 and then installing it over whatever version of Windows your PC came with would be expensive and could be problematic if that version was Windows 10, so I can’t really recommend it. (Nor will I test it.) But if you upgraded to Windows 10 … Hm. Moving back to Windows 8.1 isn’t a terrible idea. In fact, it’s the best of these choices, I think, assuming you can do it. Lots of assumptions in there, I know.

#2. Windows 7

Advantages: Runs Windows desktops applications

Disadvantages: Updating is purposefully broken, will never see another feature update, doesn’t support UWP apps/Windows Store, may require additional security software, dated look and feel

Bottom line: While Windows 7 has its fans, I find this system to be dated looking, and the update story is a mess. But it still offers universal compatibility with the Windows desktop application everyone uses, which is Job One, of course. That said, like Windows 8.1, you’re not going to take a new Windows 10 PC and revert it to the Windows 7, for the most part. So this option is really only available to those who have a PC that came with Windows 7 originally. And have the install media.

#3. Mac

Advantages: Clean system for technical users, MacBook Air laptops are not expensive, cross-platform features with i-devices are impressive

Disadvantages: Modern Macs are very expensive, requires you to buy a new device and learn a new OS, you need to accept Apple lock-in for the best experience, learning curve, no multi-touch or pen support, doesn’t run Windows apps

Bottom line: The Mac is not easy to use at first, but it has a smaller learning curve than Linux, and you can’t argue about the quality of the hardware, even for out-of-date devices like the MacBook Air. What you get when you fork over your credit card is a clean system best suited for technical users or those who willingly toss aside choice to embrace Apple’s admittedly solid cross-platform capabilities. The combination of a Mac with an iPhone and/or iPad is a sight to behold, and Apple offers features—like the ability to send and receive text messages through macOS—that Microsoft is still stumbling around trying to figure out. Again, you pay for the privilege—with both your wallet and your soul—but it’s not hard to understand why so many make this choice. But it’s a big step into the unknown, too.

#4. Chromebook

Advantages: Simple to use and maintain, Android app support is coming, inexpensive hardware

Disadvantages: Still feels limited compared to PCs or Macs, learning curve, Android app support is still a dream, requires you to buy a new device, doesn’t run Windows apps

Bottom line: Chromebook still feels like the type of thing you’d give to a child. But with Android app support coming and a new generation of touch-capable 2-in-1-type Chromebooks appearing this year, that could change. Regardless, Chromebooks win big in the simplicity department, even now, and if you know someone who only runs a few web apps and only sometimes needs a keyboard, it’s a viable option. Just not for me.

#5. Linux

Advantages: Free, runs well on older (or newer) PC hardware, easy to evaluate on older PCs or in a VM

Disadvantages: Doesn’t run Windows apps, too many distribution choices, learning curve, complex underpinnings will be daunting for many users, mostly dated look and feel

Bottom line: Despite many attempts to simplify Linux and make it look or work more like Windows, it remains the most technical alternative available. But it’s free–like, really free—and can be easily evaluated. It’s also an interesting option for an older PC, since Linux tends to run well on such machines. If you don’t mind a bit of complexity and uncertainty—or, maybe that is what you’re looking for—Linux has matured greatly over the years. Start with a user-friendly version if possible, like Ubuntu or Mint Linux with Cinnamon.

Or, just keep calm and carry on with Windows 10

Advantages: Runs Windows desktop applications and modern UWP apps, modern look and feel, works well across form factors, modern hardware support, gets regular feature updates

Disadvantages: Update reliability issues, constant updating can trigger unwanted reboots, in-OS advertising is getting worse over time

Bottom line: Look, I love Windows 10. There are issues both real (in-box advertising/update reliability) and invented (privacy FUD), but it’s still the most modern PC platform available. It works well on an incredible range of form factors, is available on an ever-increasing range of often-innovative new PCs, and it works with both the desktop applications that we need today and the UWP mobile platform that I feel is the future of Windows. I don’t see myself ever looking back. But as noted, I will continue to evaluate other platforms, if only to discover those occasional gems that need to make their way to Windows too.


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  • 4325

    20 January, 2017 - 2:57 pm

    <p>You put doesn’t runs UWP apps as a disadvantage but constantly point out that there aren’t any good ones, that the store hasn’t taken off and never will.&nbsp;</p>

    • 1377

      Premium Member
      20 January, 2017 - 8:06 pm

      <p><em><a href="#37994">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/adamcorbally">adamcorbally</a><a href="#37994">:</a></em></p>
      <p>Have you noticed that on Windows Weekly there are weekly beer picks but never any Windows Store picks?</p>

      • 4841

        21 January, 2017 - 6:45 am

        <blockquote><em><a href="#38054">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/hrlngrv">hrlngrv</a><a href="#38054">:</a></em></blockquote>
        <p>But it’s not truly a Mary Jo Foley show without beer picks! 🙁 lol</p>

      • 5456

        Premium Member
        23 January, 2017 - 7:52 am

        <blockquote><em><a href="#38054">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/hrlngrv">hrlngrv</a><a href="#38054">:</a></em></blockquote>
        <p>Because nobody needs the Windows Store but many like beer? 😀 </p>

    • 6453

      Premium Member
      23 January, 2017 - 7:04 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#37994">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/adamcorbally">adamcorbally</a><a href="#37994">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>I wish app stores would lose the movie-poster-like front pages.</p>
      <p>And somehow figure out how to put exact-match search results at the top.</p>
      <p>Also allow a "details" view that can sort or filter by publisher.</p>
      <p>If someone searches an app store for "facebook," maybe just maybe they want&nbsp;<em>the actual Facebook app made by Facebook,</em> and not dozens of me-too knockoffs that only included the name for SEO.</p>

      • 1377

        Premium Member
        23 January, 2017 - 10:22 pm

        <p><em><a href="#38426">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/karlinhigh">karlinhigh</a><a href="#38426">:</a></em></p>
        <p>As a practical matter, the Windows Store’s probable customer base would be 80% PC users, 15% Xbox users, 5% phones, tablets, IoT and Hololens users, so what could possibly be wrong with designing it for the 20%?</p>

  • 4841

    20 January, 2017 - 2:58 pm

    <p>Why is in-OS advertising such a hassle when you can just go to ‘Settings &gt; System &gt; Notifications and Actions’ and turn off ‘Get tips, tricks and suggestions as you use Windows’? And that’s if you’re getting them: I’ve been using Windows 10 for almost two years and never got a single ad.</p>

    • 5456

      Premium Member
      20 January, 2017 - 11:08 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#37995">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Demileto">Demileto</a><a href="#37995">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>It isnt only the ads staff. Its also that with every Update, MSFT did cut some features from the Pro Versions and keeps telling how I should use Windows 10. And, there is no easy way to uninstall the Windows 10 build in apps like Mail, Groove, Photos and so on. </p>

      • 4841

        21 January, 2017 - 6:51 am

        <blockquote><em><a href="#38078">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/SherlockHolmes">SherlockHolmes</a><a href="#38078">:</a></em></blockquote>
        <p>That feature cut from Pro was bad form, I agree, but to be fair I only saw Microsoft do it once, when they released Anniversary Update.&nbsp;</p>
        <p>About uninstalling Windows 10 built in apps: I could swear that they announced that they’d widen the ability to uninstall those apps, but I guess I misunderstood it somehow because that indeed can’t be done trivially through an Uninstall option in Start’s&nbsp;context&nbsp;menu.</p>

        • 5456

          Premium Member
          21 January, 2017 - 7:48 am

          <blockquote><em><a href="#38093">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Demileto">Demileto</a><a href="#38093">:</a></em></blockquote>
          <p>So what makes you think that there wont be a feature cut with the Creators Update? The other thing is that MSFT thinks that their customers are stupid. With every Update there are lesser choices. I want to decide for myself if I want to use a lockscreen or not. </p>

          • 1377

            Premium Member
            21 January, 2017 - 2:38 pm

            <p><em><a href="#38100">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/SherlockHolmes">SherlockHolmes</a><a href="#38100">:</a></em></p>
            <p>Absolutely agree about the lock screen on effectively single-user immobile PCs: WHAT’S THE POINT?</p>

      • 1377

        Premium Member
        21 January, 2017 - 2:35 pm

        <p><em><a href="#38078">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/SherlockHolmes">SherlockHolmes</a><a href="#38078">:</a></em></p>
        <p>Maybe no EASY way to uninstall bundled cruft, but Powershell can eliminate most of the cruft (though sadly not the new holographic cruft which is pointless on PCs which lack holographic devices).</p>
        <p>Consider this convergence: Windows becoming more like Linux, needing a command line more often.</p>

        • 5456

          Premium Member
          21 January, 2017 - 11:12 pm

          <blockquote><em><a href="#38135">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/hrlngrv">hrlngrv</a><a href="#38135">:</a></em></blockquote>
          <p>The problem is most users wont use Powershell. Like Mary Jo Foley for an example. </p>

        • 442

          22 January, 2017 - 4:05 pm

          <blockquote><em><a href="#38135">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/hrlngrv">hrlngrv</a><a href="#38135">:</a>&nbsp; "Maybe no EASY way to uninstall bundled cruft, but Powershell can eliminate most of the cruft&nbsp;"</em></blockquote>
          <blockquote><em>Right click, uninstall.&nbsp; I’m sure how&nbsp;easier they could make it?&nbsp; And not everyone wants to remove everything, or needs to.</em></blockquote>

          • 1377

            Premium Member
            22 January, 2017 - 4:34 pm

            <p><em><a href="#38220">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Narg">Narg</a><a href="#38220">:</a></em></p>
            <p>Not all bundled apps have Uninstall entries in their right-click menus, e.g., 3DBuilder, Groove Music, Movies &amp; TV, Solitaire Collection, and, for someone who has Office 365 installed, the utterly worthless Get Office.</p>
            <p>Of course some don’t want to remove anything, and they’re about the only group MSFT satisfies entirely. However, one of Windows’s strengths compared to OS X/macOS over the years has been the greater customization of Windows. Are you saying this has been a mistake, and MSFT is correcting that mistake by adopting a more Apple-like approach?</p>

      • 5027

        23 January, 2017 - 3:51 pm

        <blockquote><em><a href="#38078">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/SherlockHolmes">SherlockHolmes</a><a href="#38078">:</a></em></blockquote>
        <p>Yes actually it is quite easy, use Powershell. We have removed almost everything on our Pro installations, it is really not that hard. We have even removed the Store</p>

    • 314

      22 January, 2017 - 9:48 am

      <blockquote><em><a href="#37995">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Demileto">Demileto</a><a href="#37995">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>Vote with your wallet people!!! Just say no to Windows 10.</p>

      • 5027

        23 January, 2017 - 3:52 pm

        <blockquote><em><a href="#38187">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Dan">Dan</a><a href="#38187">:</a></em></blockquote>
        <p>Vote with your Wallet for something you most likely did not pay for in the first place?&nbsp;</p>

    • 6453

      Premium Member
      23 January, 2017 - 6:57 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#37995">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Demileto">Demileto</a><a href="#37995">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>The stuff I really don’t like are the start menu tiles for media and entertainment. Even on a clean ISO install, one click on Candy Crush and my preteen children are now in a social-heavy in-app-purchase game with other people that have&nbsp;usernames based on reproductive organs.</p>

  • 5530

    20 January, 2017 - 3:01 pm

    <p>The only good thing about Windows 8.1 is the speed and stability. Usability wise, it’s a disaster, there is no way i’m going back by choice to dealing with the stupid charms menu and hot corners. The ads in Windows 10 are a small price to pay to escape the disastrous UX of Windows 8.</p>
    <p>Windows 7 is simply a non-starter on new hardware. Windows 7 also can take around&nbsp;5 seconds to boot on a SSD. Windows 10 would boot up in 2 seconds. There’s no question about it.</p>

    • 6181

      20 January, 2017 - 3:35 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#37996">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/FalseAgent">FalseAgent</a><a href="#37996">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>Install Classic Shell and then you are back to great usability, lack of charms and hot corners.</p>

      • 1377

        Premium Member
        20 January, 2017 - 8:51 pm

        <p><em><a href="#38005">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/rgelb">rgelb</a><a href="#38005">:</a></em></p>

    • 5606

      22 January, 2017 - 7:48 am

      <blockquote><em><a href="#37996">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/FalseAgent">FalseAgent</a><a href="#37996">:</a></em>&nbsp;Windows 7 also can take around 5 seconds to boot on a SSD. Windows 10 would boot up in 2 seconds.&nbsp;</blockquote>
      <p>&nbsp;Yup, that’s 3 invaluable seconds of your day you’ll never get back.</p>

    • 5486

      22 January, 2017 - 12:32 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#37996">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/FalseAgent">FalseAgent</a><a href="#37996">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>Wow. What do you do with your life in those extra few seconds? Obviously worth it. No question.</p>

  • 8578

    20 January, 2017 - 3:03 pm

    <p>If you need legacy Windows programs there’s really no reason to switch away from Windows. I prefer Windows 7 although I recognize that it isn’t going to be supported. I don’t care about UWP apps (like most Windows users I suspect), "modern look and feel" just means different UI design choices, about as meaningful to me as "New and Improved" is to floor wax. Working well across different form factors would matter if anybody was going to use W10 across different device types but the number of people doing that is statistically irrelevant.&nbsp;</p>

  • 3233

    Premium Member
    20 January, 2017 - 3:14 pm

    <p>How about great high dpi support on OSX , if I see one more blurred interface on my 4k monitor with Windows 10 I am going to scream (I use both daily, though OSX is my daily driver these days)</p>

    • 6242

      Premium Member
      22 January, 2017 - 1:37 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#37999">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/markiehill">markiehill</a><a href="#37999">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>I will agree however it is really the applications that need to be updated. I like the progress that MS is making. I have two three screen setups I go between and generally&nbsp;it works very nicely every time I dock up.</p>

  • 1292

    20 January, 2017 - 3:24 pm

    <p>Windows 10 all the way here. Don’t think the alts. including MAC hold a candle. As a recent user of Android however, Chromebooks on a 2 in 1 platform seem interesting. Perhaps this is response to the lousy Android tablet experience. &nbsp;</p>

    • 3233

      Premium Member
      20 January, 2017 - 3:32 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38000">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/FreeJAC">FreeJAC</a><a href="#38000">:</a>&nbsp;I&nbsp;try to love Windows but it is a mess (getting better) – I was a&nbsp;heavy Windows user since 3.1 until Windows 8 and&nbsp;I gave up and went to the dark side , though&nbsp;I still use both daily …. Windows 10 for work. OSX is cleaner and just works (High DPI support etc) and integrates with its mobile devices well, just think about iMessage, Continuity , Handoff etc … Microsoft dropped the ball big time , even the Windows mobile&nbsp;devices we were&nbsp;made to use at work are being replaced with Android or IOS devices. Microsoft are only now finding their way back … but geez&nbsp;even the much lauded Surface Pro 3/4 is a buggy mess which exudes heat and a stupid&nbsp;amount of fan noise when asked to do anything. And Windows on a tablet you have to be having a&nbsp;laugh ! Search also works properly on OSX .. I do prefer&nbsp;Windows explorer&nbsp;though to finder – I&nbsp;just wish MS&nbsp;could get their act together quicker.</em></blockquote>

      • 124

        Premium Member
        20 January, 2017 - 4:28 pm

        <blockquote><em><a href="#38002">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/markiehill">markiehill</a><a href="#38002">:</a></em></blockquote>
        <p>I just don’t get it.</p>
        <p>"but geez&nbsp;even the much lauded Surface Pro 3/4 is a buggy mess which exudes heat and a stupid&nbsp;amount of fan noise when asked to do anything. And Windows on a tablet you have to be having a&nbsp;laugh ! "</p>
        <p>I had an original Surface Pro.&nbsp; Never had a problem and yes it ran a little warm with fan blowing. I just upgraded to a Surface Pro 4. Fantastic machine and only hear the fan on rare occasion like when I put it to sleep or shut it down.&nbsp; I also have a dell tablet which I use mainly as ebook reader.&nbsp; Desk top machine and all run mostly smoothly.&nbsp; Occasionally a glitch.&nbsp; I have a MacBook also and truthfully have had about as many problems with it as my Windows machines.&nbsp; So&nbsp;my guess is either I am really blessed or others are just the opposite.</p>

        • 3233

          Premium Member
          20 January, 2017 - 4:57 pm

          <blockquote><em><em><a href="#38013">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/lwetzel">lwetzel</a><a href="#38013">:</a>&nbsp;</em></em>
          <p>Well&nbsp;I have had two&nbsp;surface pro 3’s and both have been&nbsp;noisy under load , fans running unless&nbsp;I hack around in the registry to throttle the CPU – keyboard sometimes&nbsp;doesn’t work, sometimes&nbsp;device does not start up and&nbsp;hangs at the surface&nbsp;screen, comes on in my bag if&nbsp;I use connected standby and then drains the battery – all well documented problems. I am a heavy user of my surface ! I&nbsp;would rather bring my&nbsp;MacBook any day of the week. I am hoping drawbridge will help with getting Windows onto ARM processors in a useable form.&nbsp;</p>

          • 241

            20 January, 2017 - 7:00 pm

            <blockquote><em><a href="#38021">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/markiehill">markiehill</a><a href="#38021">:</a></em></blockquote>
            <p>I have a SP3 and a SP4. The difference btw them is night and day. SP3 gets very hot/fans run very loud.&nbsp; SP4 is not like that at all. It is not an iPad but I use it every day, more as a tablet vs. a laptop. I recently stopped using a Dell Venue Pro 8 but used it for years as a consumption device.&nbsp; I have a iPad mini (1st gen) that is so clunky to use. Yes, it is 1st gen but geez, I am just using web browser, Kindle, Audible, TuneIn, Groove, etc.</p>

          • 6242

            Premium Member
            22 January, 2017 - 1:42 pm

            <blockquote><em><a href="#38021">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/markiehill">markiehill</a><a href="#38021">:</a></em></blockquote>
            <p>P.S. The keyboards suck on&nbsp;Macs – mushy keys. I do remember them being better but now they are really not good at all.</p>

      • 6242

        Premium Member
        22 January, 2017 - 1:41 pm

        <blockquote><em><a href="#38002">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/markiehill">markiehill</a><a href="#38002">:</a></em></blockquote>
        <p>OSX is horrible.&nbsp;It is&nbsp;such an unclear user interface design – OSX/Macs are living off a reputation from the 90’s. Windows 10 is&nbsp;by far and away a superior operating system and much easier to use.</p>

  • 1243

    20 January, 2017 - 3:28 pm

    <p>Microsoft really lost their way with Windows 10. I get it. They need to find a way to stay relevant and make money in the post&nbsp;software on a disc world. <br />It used to be, they could sit back and sell millions of Windows CDs, Office CDs, etc.</p>
    <p>It feels like a rudderless ship, like they’re floating in circles and hoping they find some kind of land at some point.</p>

    • 2585

      21 January, 2017 - 8:52 am

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38001">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/pwrof3">pwrof3</a><a href="#38001">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>The "rudder" is a changing business model. Thus&nbsp;anything that leads its users to subscription services (perpetual licenses are essentially dead).</p>

  • 6181

    20 January, 2017 - 3:34 pm

    <p>I would recommend Windows 8.1 with Classic Shell. &nbsp;This way you have a pretty awesome OS plus the normal start menu. &nbsp;And you never get to see any of the metro apps.</p>
    <p>The OS is speedy and performant. &nbsp;I don’t remember the last time it crashed. &nbsp;Runs all the apps I need. &nbsp;</p>

    • 5535

      20 January, 2017 - 10:04 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38003">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/rgelb">rgelb</a><a href="#38003">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>Just reverted back to Win 8 today coincidentally. &nbsp;Having issues with Windows Update finding… ANYTHING. &nbsp;Is this a common problem nowdays?</p>

      • 10158

        20 January, 2017 - 10:43 pm

        <blockquote><em><a href="#38069">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/pachi">pachi</a><a href="#38069">:</a></em></blockquote>
        <p>I had that issue when I upgraded the HTPC from Win 7 recently. I had to format and reinstall Windows 8.1. After that, it runs fine and gets the updates (EPG on WMC worked well too). Seems Windows 8.x doesn’t always install cleanly.&nbsp;</p>

        • 5535

          20 January, 2017 - 11:29 pm

          <blockquote><em><a href="#38075">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Darmok N Jalad">Darmok N Jalad</a><a href="#38075">:</a></em></blockquote>
          <p>Well, I did that already, two clean installs. &nbsp;This is it worked until I did a big update, and now I am back to the endless, not finding any updates… I hate what MS has become…</p>

    • 5554

      21 January, 2017 - 4:35 am

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38003">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/rgelb">rgelb</a><a href="#38003">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>Yep. &nbsp;Windows 8.1 with StartISBack or Classicshell is the best of both worlds. Kernel improvements of 8.0/8.1 that they pushed into 8.2 (Windows 10), minus all the bullshit telemetry and ads and Cortina and forced updates where you could wake up to a borked PC any morning after an update.&nbsp;</p>
      <p>10 might be a good OS someday, but MS keeps trying to see how much they can get away with before the blowback from Enterprise forces their retreat back to sanity. Fuckem.</p>

  • 4482

    Premium Member
    20 January, 2017 - 3:46 pm

    <p>The one and only reason I switched from Mac to Windows was to run some applications that are not available anywhere else. It’s all about software availability. You all keep saying how "professional" and "productive" this OS is, but I’m not seeing it.</p>
    <p>Even just scrolling in supplied applications doesn’t work and Microsoft opened a bug for me. &nbsp;What do I mean? Open Edge, News, Money or similar apps and try to page up/down. It won’t. Get past the start page, and it works. Probably a framework issue, but this is <em>scrolling&nbsp;</em>I’m talking about.</p>
    <p>PDF editing is non existent without paying Adobe, and yeah, I often need to deal with businesses where moving pages around in PDF documents is necessary. On Windows, it is easier to re-print the document and use Vuescan to scan it. Not the built in scanner, mind, because it doesn’t work to my networked scanner.</p>
    <p>Yeah, I’m just griping. Once I’m in the apps I need to run, I couldn’t care less what’s behind the screen. And I’m stuck with those apps, so here I am.</p>

    • 124

      Premium Member
      20 January, 2017 - 4:17 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38006">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/bservies">bservies</a><a href="#38006">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>You have problems but I don’t think it is windows.&nbsp; PgUp and PgDn works fine on my machines.&nbsp; There are many less expensive PDF viewers and editors.</p>

      • 4482

        Premium Member
        20 January, 2017 - 4:33 pm

        <blockquote><em><a href="#38012">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/lwetzel">lwetzel</a><a href="#38012">:</a></em></blockquote>
        <p>Ah, yes. The "you’re holding it wrong" response. Subtle.</p>
        <p>Microsoft reproduced my issue immediately and agreed it was a bug.</p>

    • 2585

      21 January, 2017 - 8:28 am

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38006">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/bservies">bservies</a><a href="#38006">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>"PDF editing is non existent without paying Adobe"</p>
      <p>You’re in an OS swimming with half decent PDF editors, many are free and several for the cost of most apps ($10 or less). Also, if you have MS Word, it works for PDF editing&nbsp;too.</p>

    • 6242

      Premium Member
      22 January, 2017 - 1:33 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38006">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/bservies">bservies</a><a href="#38006">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>I just set up a graphic designer with a new&nbsp;iMac 5k system. OSX is a painful experience. If a new&nbsp;user with no computer&nbsp;knowledge tried to get up and running on OSX&nbsp;they&nbsp;could not figure it out easily without help from someone. Windows 10 is a vastly superior OS for experienced users and for the first time user.&nbsp;Mac’s need an overhaul when it comes to ease of use.</p>

  • 5485

    20 January, 2017 - 3:58 pm

    <p>Personally if budget is not the core&nbsp;concern I would put the Mac on top anytime.</p>
    <p>I’m a technical person, so according to Thurrot I may be biased, yet my family is not. My wife, a teacher, the least non technical person I have met, was disgruntled when I said … you need to use my Surface Pro 2 now. Better when she started using the Surface Pro 3, but she told me the other day … "I’m waiting for your upgrade to get yours". My 6 years old is using the MacBook Pro from 2009, runs swell for what he wants to do … he actually prefers it to the iPad for certain tasks (6 years old, go figure). My eldest is using the Surface Pro 2 now for his school work and an Android tablet for other stuff.</p>
    <p>The main problem of Mac is not the lock-in. Its locks you in as much as Windows. People say over and over again, the main concern with Mac is that it does not run Windows apps … well that is pretty much down to Windows lock-n isn’t it? Still you always have Parallels.</p>
    <p>The main problem is price, people need to learn it, most people were "born" to tech in Windows still. On the other hand the price of entry. If you want a brand new Mac, one needs to shell out at least $1000.&nbsp;</p>
    <p>Is it worth it?&nbsp;Yes, for me is for many reason. (if you &nbsp;are a conscious user with a non consumerist mentality the middle range (1500) can go for 4 to 5 years and after that, still have better performance than a low end Windows 10 PC, it is still to ask)</p>
    <p>I the idea of Windows 10, in practice, I’m not really that impressed.</p>

  • 1561

    Premium Member
    20 January, 2017 - 4:05 pm

    <p>or…upgrade your Windows 10 license to Pro. It does everything you want and includes less of the crap you don’t.</p>

    • 5234

      20 January, 2017 - 4:50 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38010">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/gregsedwards">gregsedwards</a><a href="#38010">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>I would say LTSB is the best since you don’t get any UWP apps, or the store, nor do you get any ads there at all, but it still includes full GPO support and domain joining.</p>

  • 2235

    20 January, 2017 - 4:38 pm

    <p>I loved Windows 8.1. I liked the metro apps, the hot corners and especially the performance. I still feel Windows 10 has a lot to catch up on in that regard. I never understood the insane level of push-back it received. The desktop was always just a click away. It is much better for 2-1s than Windows 10.&nbsp;</p>

    • 1377

      Premium Member
      20 January, 2017 - 8:50 pm

      <p><em><a href="#38016">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/potzy1">potzy1</a><a href="#38016">:</a></em></p>
      <p>For most it seems one click away was one click too many.</p>
      <p>Myself, it seems obvious that providing more UI choices, including a true 8.x mode rather than the current tablet mode, as well as a more customizable Start menu would make the greatest number of Windows users as happy as possible. It seems MSFT has little or no interest in maximizing user happiness.</p>

  • 5510

    20 January, 2017 - 4:51 pm

    <p>*Rolls eye*….just keep Windows 10, for now. For The people who read and actively participate on this site, where are they going to go? They are not going to Mac, because Macs are boring and expensive. It won’t be for another 10 years until you can touch the screen on a Mac for effect.</p>
    <p>As for Linux, don’t waste your time. Why go thru all the hassle of learning a new OS with extremely limited capability? Yes, Linux is the most secure, trusted and arguably the best OS in the planet, but it’s not user-friendly. In 2007, Leo Laporte convinced me, in one of his podcasts, that Ubuntu was on par, in terms of user-friendliness, with Windows and Mac, but it was not. I built an Ubuntu machine for a lawyer colleague/friend and he had a terrible time using it. He had no choice, but to buy a retail copy of Windows and install it.</p>
    <p>As for Android,…Paul said no good tablets? Funny, I don’t recall ever reading a blog post from Paul of him reviewing a Pixel product other than the recent Pixel phone. Again, the trademark"Pixel" means all Google. The trademark "iOS" means an Apple product. In addition, there is a difference between a Pixel and a Nexus. Paul can’t tell the difference because he does a half-a**’d job analyzing the Google products.</p>
    <p>As for Chromebooks,…huh? Paul says that one disadvantage is "learning curve?" Is he kidding me? Relatives of mine who are in their 70’s are using their Chromebooks flawlessly. Seriously, what learning curve is Paul talking about? LOL…that’s funny. My mother, who had a hard time navigating thru WIndows 7 is running her Church group with her Chromebook and Samsung Galaxy S7. She creates newsletters with Google Docs and even USES it’s extensible features. Not only that, but she forms events and using Google Calendar and sends invitations thru it. Those people who don’t use Google Calendar, when she sends those invites, gets an ICS file to click. LOL..she even creates guestlists thru Forms and Sheets and even edits photos using Google Photos and Autodesk’s Pixlr. People, this is MY MOM…who still has a hard time figuring out how to get to the Amazon Firestick on her HDMI output,…but she can operate her Chromebook very well. So when Paul says that you can’t do real work on a Chromebook or anything other than a Windows PC, he is either not telling the truth or doesn’t know how to work.</p>
    <p>If a Windows 10 user is really bothered by the small ads and is afraid that the it’s only going to get worse, then use Windows 7. In terms of usability, there is no big difference between Windows 10 and Windows 7. NONE, whatsoever. Even after a year and half since Microsoft gave Windows 10 away for free, people STILL OPT to keep Windows 7. Hmmm…why is that? Is it because, it just works and people just use it to go on the internet? Yeah, that’s EXACTLY IT! That’s why Chromebooks are rising in popularity. Google sees it and guess who else? MICROSOFT.</p>

    • 1377

      Premium Member
      20 January, 2017 - 8:35 pm

      <p><em><a href="#38018">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Bats">Bats</a><a href="#38018">:</a></em></p>
      <p>Re Chromebook learning curve, the article includes learning curve for everything not Windows, so it seems to mean adapting to other than how Windows does things. Certainly the launcher in the shelf is different than Windows’s Start menu/screen or macOS’s Dock or Finder.</p>
      <p>People who aren’t gamers, don’t need full Office, don’t need PhotoShop can get by remarkably well with Chromebooks. Heck, large enterprises with Citrix or VMWare remote computing services could get by quite nicely indeed with Chromeboxes as most employees’ desktop computer.</p>

      • 6181

        21 January, 2017 - 9:33 pm

        <blockquote><em><a href="#38060">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/hrlngrv">hrlngrv</a><a href="#38060">:</a></em></blockquote>
        <p>I agree with you regarding the learning curve. &nbsp;I do not agree on the remote computing services for large enterprises. &nbsp;That is what my employer implemented (I believe the Cisco branded one) – and there are all kinds of issues. &nbsp;From speed to rendering issues and so on. &nbsp;Sometimes a mouse click will take 500ms to 1s to register. &nbsp;I mean, the&nbsp;workers got used to it, but they hate it. &nbsp;I hate it because the software that I painstakingly wrote and cared for is now&nbsp;thought of as slow and clunky because of the Remote Desktop issues. &nbsp;<br /><br />My feeling is that for RD technology to work well, you need a really stable 10Gpbs network.</p>

        • 1377

          Premium Member
          21 January, 2017 - 10:28 pm

          <p><em><a href="#38158">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/rgelb">rgelb</a><a href="#38158">:</a></em></p>
          <p>Networks are likely to get faster, so latency should decrease over time. OTOH, the economics of centralization have been, are and will continue to be compelling not least because the only software which needs to be maintained on each client machine are the OS and the remote desktop client app.</p>
          <p>My own experience is limited to Citrix, and I’ve had I/O latency problems, but there are advantages too, e.g., Excel models with lots of VBA. I’ve written WSH scripts to automate Excel and VBA in order to automate updating VBA modules on client machines. Not the most robust task in today’s workplace software maintenance. Much easier and more robust to update one copy on a server.</p>
          <p>Also, I’m old, so I can remember REAL LATENCY like mainframe terminals with 110 baud dial-up connections. The young are so spoiled.</p>

    • 10158

      20 January, 2017 - 10:54 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38018">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Bats">Bats</a><a href="#38018">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>Eventually, you stop caring if an OS is boring, and you start caring if it works as expected. I have an iPad, and the battery life is amazing. Put it to sleep, and it will wake up the next day with the same battery percentage as when you last used it. It sleeps very well, and it WAKES from sleep correctly and rarely needs restarting. Every Surface I’ve owned has had wake issues–from not loading SD cards or detecting the type cover upon resume, to simply not waking at all. They also lose a decent amount of battery when sleeping. I use my iPad a few hours each day and only have to plug it in a couple times a week. That iPad experience led me to get an iPhone and a Mac mini. Heck, Office365 makes it that much easier to switch.&nbsp;</p>

  • 5234

    20 January, 2017 - 4:54 pm

    <p>I don’t see Mac’s being any more polished than a good distro of Linux. &nbsp;And by polished, I don’t mean Ubuntu. &nbsp;Ubuntu has way too much adware in it. &nbsp;I’m talking about versions like Fedora or openSUSE, or even Solus. &nbsp;Budgie is a better desktop than Cinnamon too.</p>

    • 1377

      Premium Member
      20 January, 2017 - 8:16 pm

      <p><em><a href="#38019">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Waethorn">Waethorn</a><a href="#38019">:</a></em></p>
      <p>Distribution or desktop environment?</p>
      <p>IMO, greater hand-holding and simplicity would be found in Elementary OS or Linux Mint (and I much prefer Debian packages to RPMs). OTOH, mimimalism would favor Bunsen Labs or Arch with i3.</p>
      <p>Anyway, the wonderful thing about Linux is choice. Maybe that’s also a weakness, but there’s something for nearly everyone.</p>

      • 3233

        Premium Member
        21 January, 2017 - 2:44 am

        <blockquote><em><a href="#38056">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/hrlngrv">hrlngrv</a><a href="#38056">:</a>&nbsp;In OSX or Windows&nbsp;I do not have to&nbsp;drop to a command line to get things done – I can but&nbsp;I don’t have to 🙂 Linux has got better but not getting around without the shell for&nbsp;anything other than very basic tasks is not really&nbsp;possible.</em></blockquote>

        • 1377

          Premium Member
          21 January, 2017 - 2:26 pm

          <p><em><a href="#38086">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/markiehill">markiehill</a><a href="#38086">:</a></em></p>
          <p>Name a commonly performed (weekly, maybe) task under Linux which requires a command line.</p>
          <p>OTOH, try counting the number of dialogs one must go through in Windows to get the same information as lsblk in Linux.</p>

          • 6453

            Premium Member
            24 January, 2017 - 10:45 am

            <blockquote><em><a href="#38133">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/hrlngrv">hrlngrv</a><a href="#38133">:</a></em></blockquote>
            <p>I wasn’t aware of the lsblk command before, thanks.</p>
            <p>It reminds me of Winkey+R, diskmgmt.msc, Enter.</p>

    • 5664

      Premium Member
      20 January, 2017 - 10:53 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38019">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Waethorn">Waethorn</a><a href="#38019">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>Night and day difference. macOS isnt a "desktop environment" running on X11. Remember that the parts of macOS that make it macOS could be ported to other operating systems.&nbsp;</p>

  • 158

    20 January, 2017 - 5:42 pm

    <p>Paul, are posts like this an indication that this site will broaden it’s topics more beyond Microsoft related news as it was the case until now? Brad said in one of the podcasts that there will be changes to this site and more travelling and as I heard that, I was wondering if you are planning to broaden the focus here. Am I wrong?</p>

    • 314

      20 January, 2017 - 10:23 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38031">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/RedSign">RedSign</a><a href="#38031">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>I’d appreciate the additional non-Microsoft content.</p>

  • 5520

    20 January, 2017 - 6:02 pm

    <p>Well now I’m in retirement, after starting in IT nearly 60 years ago and having been a full on Windows user since W3.11, I’ve simply become fed up with the twists and turns of keeping W10 viable for my family use. I’ve started on a migration towards Chromebook with setting up a Linux file server for our mass of data and expecting to move over to Chromebooks in late 2018 once the Chromebook/Android apps/Andromeda dust settles</p>

  • 10152

    20 January, 2017 - 6:06 pm

    <p>Unfortunately, I can no longer make a case for Windows on most platforms. My&nbsp;first step was to replace&nbsp;my storage&nbsp;server with FreeNAS, since rebooting for updates &amp; maintenance was&nbsp;no longer an option. It has been a flawless experience.</p>
    <p>The second step was trying out Linux on my HiDPI carbon. Since the DE (GNOME) and all&nbsp;stock applications support HiDPI&nbsp;out of the box, i really started enjoying my laptop again. I found the GNOME DE to be very simple and consistently uniform, a stark contrast to what windows provides today. I really needed a robust system with a great text editor that provides syntax highlighting, spell checking and a dark theme across the board, for the long coding hours at night. Also native integration with online accounts&nbsp;(microsoft, google, amazon, et al) was a big bonus, since i no longer required multiple 3rd party apps to access my online content. Everything from contacts, calendaring, files etc, is&nbsp;nicely integrated with the default contacts, calendar and file manager applications.</p>
    <p>As far as maintenance goes, i&nbsp;was pleasantly surprised&nbsp;to discover i could update my system at my own convenience, top to bottom, from the kernel all the way up to the fonts with one simple command, no reboot required.&nbsp;</p>
    <p>Finally, as Paul accurately observes, performance is another area where Linux really&nbsp;excels. It’s nice&nbsp;seeing a clean system, boot in&nbsp;3&nbsp;seconds&nbsp;and&nbsp;handle anything with speed.</p>

  • 8616

    20 January, 2017 - 6:13 pm

    <p>I’m using Manjaro linux for about half a year now, started with ubuntu a couple of months before that. I just wanted to see if I could do everything I normally did on Windows and the answer is ‘yes’.</p>
    <p>Is it a better OS? I don’t know, but I like that I’m more in control of what’s going on on my machine. I like the ability to tweak the GUI without 3rd party tools.&nbsp;</p>
    <p>It’s was partly a personal challenge and partly because I was getting irritated with Microsoft for messing around and taking way too much time to make Windows 10 a great OS. It feels like there’s no driving force behind it, just a bunch of people with great ideas.</p>

    • 1377

      Premium Member
      20 January, 2017 - 9:39 pm

      <p><em><a href="#38039">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Igor Engelen">Igor Engelen</a><a href="#38039">:</a></em></p>
      <blockquote><em>. . .&nbsp;without 3rd party tools . . .</em></blockquote>
      <p>Since the kernel developers, core utility developers, editor developers, application developers overlap only occasionally, pretty much everything in Linux (and BSD) is 3rd party tools. Distributions are little more than collecting and curating 3rd party tools. It’s the rare distribution which develops much itself (Canonical/Ubuntu develops Unity, Linux Mint develops Cinnamon).</p>

      • 8616

        21 January, 2017 - 12:46 pm

        <blockquote><em><a href="#38067">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/hrlngrv">hrlngrv</a><a href="#38067">:</a></em></blockquote>
        <p>Fair enough. Should have said ‘without having to install additional software ‘.</p>

  • 7260

    20 January, 2017 - 6:46 pm

    <p>A post from you that talks about PC options to Windows 10 is a post that underscores the precarious position Microsoft is in from a consumer perspective.&nbsp;</p>
    <p>Both Apple and Google have market positions that unless they screw up, almost guarantees Microsoft’s irrelevance in the consumer space and a crumbling position in the business market longer term.&nbsp; Yes, it will have a nice business, like IBM, but no longer can it impose its will on the industry has it has in the past.&nbsp;</p>
    <p>I wonder if in a couple of years, this&nbsp;column will be seen as early eulogy to what we knew as Microsoft in the past.</p>
    <p>Mark from CO</p>

    • 6242

      Premium Member
      22 January, 2017 - 1:48 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38045">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Mark from CO">Mark from CO</a><a href="#38045">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>Your post is too funny.&nbsp;You do realize Mac’s have less than 10% of the PC market, Chrome books…</p>
      <p>Most people use PCs aka Windows&nbsp;in their life. If you are banking on Tablets and mobile phones as taking over the productivity space you are sorely mistaken. There is a growing debate whether tablets (iPads or Android based) will even be a thing in 5&nbsp;- 10 years from now.&nbsp;Tablets are growing redundant vs a productivity PC&nbsp;and a good mobile device.&nbsp;</p>

  • 8275

    20 January, 2017 - 7:27 pm

    <p>Interesting what you said about Windows 8.1 I found it to be the exact opposite, in fact I think it’s far more suited to tablets than Windows 10 is. I get what Microsoft needed to do with Windows 10 to make it more desktop friendly, but I actually really wish I could run 10 on my laptop and 8.1 on my Surface Pro.</p>
    <p>Also your comment about not being able to run Windows apps on Linux and Mac is completely wrong (the exception being UWP.</p>

    • 1377

      Premium Member
      20 January, 2017 - 8:47 pm

      <p><em><a href="#38049">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/mattgoldman">mattgoldman</a><a href="#38049">:</a></em></p>
      <p>You touch on the real weakness of Windows 10: it’s an existential compromise. I’ve never used Windows tablets, but I have heard from many others that Windows 8.x had a better tablet UI, and certainly its All Apps view is superior to the Windows 10 equivalent. Would it truly have been too much to have expected from MSFT to have the straight Windows 8.x UI (maybe even including charms) as Windows 10’s tablet mode, and something like the customizability of Classic Shell for the Start menu in PC mode?</p>
      <p>Apparently it is too much to expect. Instead we get an OS UI guaranteed to disappoint the largest number of users while not pissing them off as much as Windows 8.x POed PC users.</p>

      • 7414

        Premium Member
        22 January, 2017 - 4:59 pm

        <blockquote><em><a href="#38062">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/hrlngrv">hrlngrv</a><a href="#38062">:</a></em></blockquote>
        <p>Windows 8.x did have a better tablet interface than Windows 10 until Anniversary Update was released. &nbsp;Many of the best features returned, like side-scrolling by swipe when browsing.</p>

    • 8578

      22 January, 2017 - 9:21 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38049">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/mattgoldman">mattgoldman</a><a href="#38049">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>The problem was MS trying to create a one-size-fits all OS. Doing so inevitably leads to a compromise of either phone/tablet or the desktop. In the case of Windows, both platforms were compromised. Keeping iOS and OSX separate certainly hasn’t hurt Apple.</p>
      <p>Having said that, MS was probably too late to market a "finger-touch" OS successfully. The current Surface devices are fundamentally Win32 machines with UWP as a bonus (and still niche devices in the PC world). The poor sales of WinRT devices made it clear that there’s not a market for a touch-only version of Windows.</p>

  • 5108

    20 January, 2017 - 7:55 pm

    <p>Having done enough Linux distros in the past, it’s an obvious fail for anyone but the "leet". Move on people.</p>

  • 1377

    Premium Member
    20 January, 2017 - 8:26 pm

    <p>What security advantages does Windows 10 have over Windows 8.1 besides UWP packaging for desktop software?</p>
    <p>I run 8.1 and 10 (Insider builds) in VMs, and I find 8.1 runs faster and uses fewer system resources. Since I use Classic Shell and don’t use either Modern or UWP universal apps, the only thing 8.1 lacks which I find occasionally useful in 10 is workspaces, but they’re not enough to justify moving from 8.1 to 10 for me.</p>
    <p>As far as Linux goes, once you start using a separate partition for /home, you’ll discover one of the major advantages of Linux over Windows. Windows really can’t handle registry hives not on C:, so no way to put %USERPROFILE% entirely on a different partition. Maybe this is too techy for most, like regular automatic backups.</p>

  • 4183

    Premium Member
    20 January, 2017 - 8:43 pm

    <p>I can’t help but think the advertising issue is over-exaggerated by the press. I’ve seen very few ads and I’ve had it installed since July 2015.&nbsp;</p>
    <p>On the one hand there are constant complaints that the Store doesn’t have enough apps, so they try to drive eyeballs to the store with very unobtrusive suggestions and all of sudden you have pieces here suggesting roll backs to Windows 7, 8.1 or even changing to MacOS! Absurd.</p>

    • 5027

      23 January, 2017 - 3:53 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38061">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Rcandelori">Rcandelori</a><a href="#38061">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>I have seen zero ad’s, because I turned it off :)&nbsp;</p>

  • 996

    Premium Member
    21 January, 2017 - 2:15 am

    <p>What in-OS advertising? I don’t see any at all :/</p>

    • 397

      21 January, 2017 - 3:36 am

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38083">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Lewk">Lewk</a><a href="#38083">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>You have only to open up Edge to see an advert in the front page somewhere, for starters!</p>

    • 6242

      Premium Member
      22 January, 2017 - 1:36 pm

      <blockquote><em><a href="#38083">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/Lewk">Lewk</a><a href="#38083">:</a></em></blockquote>
      <p>It’s really a non issue. Every time I search on&nbsp;google I am hit with some type&nbsp;of ad.&nbsp;In Windows 10…have no idea how it interferes with anything at all.</p>

  • 6525

    21 January, 2017 - 2:40 am

    <p>For those with a high concern about data privacy, other alternatives are:</p>
    <p>1) Use Windows 10 offline only. Use other computers with other OSs online.</p>
    <p>2) Convince Microsoft of enabling completely turned off telemetry / diagnostics in Windows 10 Home / Pro. Windows Updates must be the only optionally permitted communication to Microsoft servers.</p>
    <p>3) Microsoft must offer Windows 10 Enterprise as Anytime Upgrade, without having to reinstall any drivers, for a reasonable one-time price.</p>
    <p>4)&nbsp;Microsoft must offer Windows 10 Enterprise as SystemBuilder at a reasonable one-time price per device or per user so that the price is reasonable for a user having only one Windows computer.</p>

    • 1377

      Premium Member
      21 January, 2017 - 10:14 pm

      <p><em><a href="#38085">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/RobertJasiek">RobertJasiek</a><a href="#38085">:</a></em></p>
      <p>Re 3 and 4, why MUST MSFT do either? It’s in MSFT’s interest to push subscriptions and drop one-off perpetual license pricing. I’d prefer continuing perpetual licenses, but I accept that MSFT wouldn’t.</p>

      • 6525

        22 January, 2017 - 12:25 am

        <blockquote><em><a href="#38159">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/hrlngrv">hrlngrv</a><a href="#38159">:</a></em></blockquote>
        <p>If MS does not offer choice between one-time payment and subscriptions, MS loses all those potential customers preferring one-time payment because they do not want to, or cannot, afford subscriptions. If MS does not offer Enterprise licenses for a single computer or user, MS loses all those potential customers (or upgrade customers) for whom a) multiple licenses are too expensive for a use on a single computer and b) privacy of Pro is not good enough because they want, or (because of their business and national laws, e.g. medical care in Germany) are required to use, Enterprise (or else Linux or Windows 7). Keeping many more customers is in the interest of MS.</p>

        • 1377

          Premium Member
          22 January, 2017 - 1:19 am

          <p><em><a href="#38163">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/RobertJasiek">RobertJasiek</a><a href="#38163">:</a></em></p>
          <p>If MSFT has gotten itself into the position in some countries that Windows 7 Pro is OK but only Windows 10 Enterprise is adequate, then MSFT has indeed screwed up royally. If that’s the case in Germany currently, then MSFT has corrections to make. Myself, I’d prefer they returned Windows 10 Pro to the status of a la carte Enterprise near equivalent, but I kinda suspect MSFT prefers ALL businesses pay more for Enterprise.</p>

  • 399

    Premium Member
    21 January, 2017 - 5:47 am

    <p>What’s the learning curve with a Chromebook? Unlearning curve maybe, but learning curve? It’s like a cut down version of Windows.</p>

  • 9542

    21 January, 2017 - 11:48 am

    <p>2 comments:</p>
    <p>- updating is seriously broken in W10, and unreliable, and it’s in my view the only real negative thing in W10</p>
    <p>- disagree about tablet choice, I’d still choose W10 tablet. iPad (like Mac PC) is good only if you go Apple all the way, and I dislike being locked into their "walled garden"</p>
    <p>Thus, I’m securely in W10 world for anything except phone, and on phone I keep Android… Like I’ve said, dislike Apple lock-ins. Google/Android has many many flaws, but still easier on my way of thinking than Apple/iOS. Both still seriously lag MS/W10 in many areas. If/when W10 moves back to phones via Qualcomm and with x86 on ARM compatibility, I can see myself moving to Microsoft’s phone as well. Their only flaw (but major one) was huge lack of quality apps.</p>

  • 958

    21 January, 2017 - 1:20 pm

    <p>Is this advertising thing showing up in Insider Builds or has it made it&nbsp;to official release builds?</p>

  • 459

    Premium Member
    21 January, 2017 - 3:03 pm

    <p>I don’t get the purpose of this post.</p>

  • 9201

    21 January, 2017 - 6:18 pm

    <p style="padding-left: 30px;">oh dear, Paul is still stuck in the past. He and Mary don’t even champion UWP, pen or touch, and still think desktop represents the only computing device of interest ( to them)</p>
    <p style="padding-left: 30px;">The future is Android,&nbsp;plain and simple. It’s capabilities are growing, and its getting everywhere, bottom up. Google is Global, Microsoft still US only centric.</p>
    <p style="padding-left: 30px;">Only legacy business &amp; a&nbsp;diminishing tech geeks champion the bloated Windows platform, with consumers and business are moving to simpler platforms.</p>
    <p style="padding-left: 30px;">But I still prefer Windows Phone.</p>

  • 8098

    22 January, 2017 - 6:56 am

    <p>If one looks how fragmented the Windows user base already is, it becomes clear that Microsoft is struggling to get users accept new operating systems for many years now. It also shows how less Microsoft cares about its customers. Windows 10 is the worst case answer of Microsoft to the fragmented user base: in future the stupid, ignorant private customers will be forced to work with each new version of the operating system.</p>

  • 5486

    22 January, 2017 - 7:41 am

    <p>Let’s be honest here. Most who are running Win10 are only running it because they got it for free. Honestly, if you weren’t buying a new PC, most wouldn’t pay &gt;$100 for it. It’s just not worth it. On release, Win10 was truly a horrendous, unstable mess. It’s improved a bit, but is still an inconsistent, buggy, intrusive, feature bloat O/S that constantly thinks it knows better and resets your settings at every opportunity.&nbsp;</p>
    <p>Windows has probably had it’s day, and MS knows it, but they still have to try and stay relevant in this fast moving world, and had to start find alternative revenue streams that stood a chance of being successful as their markets eroded. Win10 only exists as a conduit for MS to gather data and push ads or recommended apps at the user in the hope they take up the offer. The Surface devices are MS just trying to re-invent the PC to help keep it relevant, and try to steal some of Apple’s high end thunder – to try and make MS cool again if you like.</p>
    <p>In reality Win7 or 8.1 actually still do pretty much everything everyone needs, but then so do Macs, Linux or Chromebooks. Infact, I don’t understand the animosity towards Chromebooks. They’re cheap, simple to operate, silent updating, almost zero malware/virus risks, and as pretty much everything is web based these days, fill most requirements. Yes, I know Google gather large amounts of information too, but your not paying an MS tax for Chromebooks – they just do the job. We have a touchscreen Chromebook, and it’s brilliant. My kids love it, and don’t have any problems at all using it.</p>
    <p>Win10 will get more intrusive as time goes on – it’s part of the big plan MS have. For example, right now, you can’t turn off Cortana, you can’t uninstall some apps, and you’re still forced to have all the updates (I don’t class ‘deferring’ as blocking). MS need full control of Win10&nbsp;to get what they need out of it, it’s just how it works.</p>

  • 7631

    22 January, 2017 - 1:44 pm

    <p>I don’t understand what the problem is with ads. I am using my Surface Book since November and I haven’t seen one ad so far. Just disable the suggestions in the settings and you are set to go.</p>

  • 442

    22 January, 2017 - 4:03 pm

    <p>My vote, keep calm and carry on.&nbsp; :)</p>

  • 7212

    23 January, 2017 - 7:59 am

    <p>There are no alternatives to Windows.<br />For me.<br />For most.<br />The shift we see unfortunately is that&nbsp;people with&nbsp;mobile devices have been rushed into using inferior&nbsp;operating systems…&nbsp;iOs, Android, Chrome’os’…<br />These are not and never will be alternatives…. for me.<br />No point making articles with titles like that… for me.<br />Windows is evolving, now for 25 years and keeps getting better and faster… I don’t need anything else, please keep the rest of that crapply,&nbsp;foogle far from me!<br />I’d buy a good Mac book pro if my budget would allow and install windows on it… yes, always the latest build I can get my hand on! of course!<br />good luck to you.</p>

  • 10175

    23 January, 2017 - 9:34 am

    <p>Paul: you mention never coming across a decent Android tablet. I must confess as an Android user I was quite jealous of my wife’s iPad mini until I came across the Samsung Galaxy Tab S2 8". I’d highly suggest taking a look at it.&nbsp;</p>
    <p>As for my home PCs and laptops, I’m sticking with Windows 10 for the time being since it is my favorite OS so far and I experiment with all of them from time to time (Mac OS X &amp; Linux included) but I do share your concerns about the slowly increasing messages and ads popping up in Windows 10.&nbsp;</p>

  • 10177

    23 January, 2017 - 11:36 am

    <blockquote><em><a href="#38010">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/gregsedwards">gregsedwards</a><a href="#38010">:</a></em></blockquote>
    <p>But then why did I pay for Windows 10 Home at all?&nbsp; Isn’t it dishonest for them to say, "Get Windows 10, it’s great!"&nbsp; And then once you bought it, "Actually, we meant that Windows 10 Pro is great.&nbsp; That’s an extra $99, please."</p>

  • 10177

    23 January, 2017 - 11:57 am

    <blockquote><em><a href="#38051">In reply to </a><a href="../../../users/burog25c">burog25c</a><a href="#38051">:</a></em></blockquote>
    <p>There are three tricks to easy use of Linux.&nbsp;</p>
    <p>First, make a list of all of the games and programs you use on Windows that you are not willing to give up.&nbsp; Research whether they run on Linux, or have Linux alternatives.&nbsp; If they don’t run on Linux, or they’re too much work to set up, then just stop.&nbsp; No sense wasting your time.&nbsp; In particular, if you’re a serious gamer then Linux is a sacrifice.</p>
    <p>Second, back up your data and <em>disconnect the backup from the PC</em>.&nbsp; You can’t accidentally erase your files if they’re somewhere else.&nbsp; I know a lot of people go for a dual boot setup on a single hard drive (or SSD), but if you’re a novice I don’t recommend it.&nbsp; If something goes wrong with a dual boot setup, it’s a pain to get everything back in working order.&nbsp; Instead install Linux onto a separate drive, so your Windows files are preserved.&nbsp; If you don’t like Linux, just disconnect the Linux drive and Windows should pick up where it left off.</p>
    <p>Third, most Linux installers will let you run Linux off the USB flash drive (faster) or DVD (slower) before installing.&nbsp; Try that, and make sure everything works – keyboard, mouse, internet access, etc…&nbsp; If your wireless card or video card isn’t recognized you can decide to&nbsp;research what replacement to get, or&nbsp;look up ways to fix it on Linux,&nbsp;or just give up and stick with Windows.&nbsp; The important thing is to identify headaches before you install it.</p>
    <p>I have four kids.&nbsp; We have three Linux PCs, two Windows PCs, and a gaming console in the house and it works fine.&nbsp;&nbsp;I almost never use Windows – but then I’m not the gamer today that I was fifteen years ago.</p>

  • 5027

    23 January, 2017 - 3:50 pm

    <p>Why not just use Windows 10, and turn off suggestions?</p>
    <p>And " ‘Settings &gt; System &gt; Notifications and Actions’ and turn off ‘Get tips, tricks and suggestions as you use Windows’? " like&nbsp;Demileto &nbsp;already mentioned</p>

  • 10572

    03 February, 2017 - 2:27 pm

    <p>I upgraded early from my Windows 7 Professional operating system to Windows 10 home OS being bought MS legal license from ODosta Store at:, Which takes 5 hours due to the internet slow speed, But faced many technical issues.<br />Beside of, I got everyday new updates from Microsoft server, That’s why I disappointed with performance of new OS, That’s why I format it and again install windows 7.<br />Last week, I read at your blog as Microsoft has stopped continually updates and now we may use constant windows 10, So I purchased its license and upgraded my OS.<br />Now its working well. Thanks for providing us great information and support.</p>

  • [email protected] 0 X

    21 January, 2019 - 5:54 pm

    <p>I'm sorry painfully so sorry. I tried so hard to like embrace Windows 10 but it's so botched in so many ways. I'm running a fully loaded $3,900.00 Alienware 17R4 and even second tier developers at Dell/Alienware finally admitted windows 10 has been a absolute nightmare for them to support. Assure paid support from Microsoft for $139.00 a year developers apologized to me admitting they have terrible issues they are constantly chasing. I use my computer for AutoCAD Photoshop, Adobe Acrobat Pro 2017 Office Pro 2016 in other words I use the hell out of my system in a productivity sense. I'm not a gamer nor do I just do basic stuff on my system it must perform on the desktop and on the go. Win 10 has let me down as no other OS I've ever used. Update 1809 is a travesty. Win 7 pro and 8.1 pro were faster and far more reliable hands down and there are millions who will blatantly agree. It's as if the new breed of developers are lost and I couldn't be more empathetic. I do have to agree with pretty much of your analysis. But that pill is extremely hard to swallow. I am at the point I hate using my computer and it has made me in many ways poorly productive because I do not enjoy using such a clunky fat and slow OS with no real outlook for it to become what it should be. It is the classic example of software not nearly ready for public release. </p>

  • Tayyib

    05 March, 2023 - 1:17 pm

    I’m a student and gamer so recently I installed Windows 11 but found some runtime issues so while contacting to Microsoft they told me to activate my operating system but their prices were high so I searched and Google recommended me ODosta Store where I found Windows 11 at about 60% off with lifetime warranty and support. Now I bought and have a licensed windows 11 so I want to recommend it to others too.

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